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spider

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Post Number: 318
Registered: 10-2002

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Votes: 0


Saturday, February 08, 2003 - 12:12 pm:

Every day Traders by Nick Radge.

I bought this book, sight unseen, because it said it was about Australian traders.
I expected to get an insight into ,at least, some of the Australian traders we have all heard of.
It didn't quite work out that way ,did it?

The blurb on the back of the book talks about "everyday Australians", well I had a hard time finding any!

Nick Radge runs a commodity funds management business.
Here we go again, another bloke trading with a heap of someone else's money! That is most of what you get in these type of books.

Where are the blokes who started out with a small amount and work it up, on their own, into a big amount? Is it just that these traders wont talk to the authors of these types of books? I noticed that Swager said that a lot of traders would not be interviewed, nick Radge says the same thing.

So we get stuck with a heap of his futures trading mates, and not a single recognizable name among them.

Where's Rene Rivkin (don't tell me he wouldn't talk! )
Where is Louise Bedford, Chris Tate, Darrell Guppy, and all the rest?

If I seem a little upset, your right !!

There is one good chapter. Chapter 8 on Richard Wynn and Nick Scott. They trade warrants. They use their own money.
This is as close as you are going to get to anyone who trades on the share market.

If you see this book in Borders, sit down and read chapter 8, but don't waste your time on the rest, unless you love to hear about blokes who manage other peoples money in commodity funds !

angler

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Post Number: 146
Registered: 12-2002

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Votes: 0


Tuesday, July 15, 2003 - 10:13 pm:

Hi guys,,

just noticed this thread while looking around.

I find the comments a little unfair,,I bought the book and when I could not find it in the store got in touch with him and received a prompt reply from his wife and sorted the problem out.
As far as I know he is not in that business anymore he works for macquarie bank now up in Noosa.
As far as those traders like Guppy etc,,they write there own books not sure they are going to offer there opinions.
He also runs one on one training courses with continued assistance after the course and has a trading forum site and like Bradford and tate does the lecture thing for the Institute.
To tell the truth I found it refreshing to read something other than from those traders you mention who seem to make there living from writing ( "seem's like" I doubt it really )and as far as Rivkin is concerned heard way to much from him.
Oh you will notice Bradford and Tate charge quite a bit to get onto there Forum, Nick runs his for free all welcome some there mind you that are not welcome but thats what you get in an open forum.

regards
Angler

spider

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Post Number: 806
Registered: 10-2002

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Votes: 1


Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 01:17 pm:

Yo angler,
glad you liked the book.
Which chapter did you like best, and why.

What did you mean when you said "I bought the book and when I could not find it in the store got in touch with him and received a prompt reply from his wife and sorted the problem out."
?

You are probably right about Guppy etc, they probably would not want to contribute.

It's Louise Bedford, not Bradford. The ladies get a bit picky about their names being spelled correctly.

Glad to hear that his forum is free, I'll check it out.

Telling me that he now works for Macquarie in Noosa, did not help his image much!

I still feel that people using other people's money to trade are not true traders, they are employees.

In spider's book, it is only when you have the courage to risk your own money , do you have the right to call yourself a trader.

In any case, fund manager's are definitely not "everyday Australians"!

Do you know how well the book went?
Is he planning to write another one?

regards
spider.

.

"The future belongs to those who believe in the beauty of their dreams."
Elanor Roosevelt.

staybaker

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Post Number: 19
Registered: 03-2003

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Votes: 0


Wednesday, July 16, 2003 - 11:53 pm:

Hi Spider,

My reaction on reading the book was exactly the same as yours ... so it was refreshing to read your opinions after hearing so many others proclaim the merits of the book. I bought it, but recommend that others save their money.

Cheers, Staybaker.

angler

Member

Post Number: 148
Registered: 12-2002

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Votes: 0


Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 12:42 am:

Hi all,,

Well thats what books do,,they bring out different opinions..
But really I dont know what you guys want in a book cant be the regurgitated stuff from all those other authors.It was a book about Aussie traders not a guide to trading or to be greatly informative and I have seen 1 of those guys in an ABC tv show on trading ( Ryan Watson )from memory so not totally unknown. Dont get me wrong I am not trying to sell the book I just found it a good casual read better than those US books about guys that have been gone many years now.

Spider,,,yes got the name wrong but I have one of her books so she would forgive me.

I would like to know of any aussie traders who trade there own account and can show they are making good money dont see any on the BRW rich list.

regards
Angler

spider

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Post Number: 809
Registered: 10-2002

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Votes: 0


Thursday, July 17, 2003 - 01:43 am:

Yo angler,
I would like to know of any aussie traders who trade there own account and can show they are making good money dont see any on the BRW rich list.

I was going to say Rene, but I suspect that he made his money as a broker, not as a trader.

I think that I would have difficulty producing a trader that fits your bill. I believe that Chris and Louise would qualify, but I could only prove it by asking to see their trading records, this I would never do.

Private traders tend not to brag about their wealth (at least this has been my experience).

But, some simple maths will tell you that it takes a reasonably large trading pool to generate the income necessary to live well. The money had to come from somewhere, but more importantly, they have to be able to trade well to be able to stay afloat, year after year.

How many fund managers are there on that list??

If I am lucky enough to live another 20 to 30years, I would be willing to bet that a few of the traders I have met would have a fighting chance of making that list.

The fact is that it is not that hard to get on to that list if you make your money from other people's hard work.

But it is damn hard to do it all on your own, and that is my point.

How hard could it be to make money if a whole lot of people give you millions of dollars of their money to trade with, AND YOU GET PAID EVEN IF YOU LOSE MONEY!

The book said "ordinary Australians". If was my error in thinking that meant more than it says.
Unfortunately the 'average Australian' does work for someone else, so I should not have been surprised to find that almost everyone in this book was doing the same.

At the turn of the century Australia had the highest percapita income of any country in the world and the equal highest standard of living (Argentina was the other one). More than 60% of Australians were self employed at the time.

We now rank somewhere in the 40s in the world, and less than 8% are self employed.

So you can see why I am less than impressed with stories about people who get paid whether than can trade or not.

Don't take any of this personally, spider feels passionately about certain issues, but that does not mean that he cannot be swayed by a persuasive argument.

Live long and prosper angler dude.

spider.

.

"The future belongs to those who believe in the beauty of their dreams."
Elanor Roosevelt.

nick__radge

Member

Post Number: 1
Registered: 07-2003

Rating:
Votes: 1


Friday, July 18, 2003 - 08:06 am:

I thought it appropriate to "clarify", not defend, the above comments.

The book was written about the personal trading of all the individuals. Agree, (1) I did know most of them. This was intentional as they could trust me with their insights and I could therefore got easier access to them. I approached others who I didn't know and they were cautious and sceptical. There are a few in that book who I didn't know of and were introduced to. (2)Two are fund managers only, Van Oayda and teh Kaleel's. These interviews focused on their own personal trading. Example: Van trades a long term trend following model for his clients whereas the interview focused on his own SPI trading. The Kaleels run a commodity fund. Their interview focused on their own stock trading. All other interviewee's traded their own money, have never managed money for other and apart from Scott, none had a desire to.

Why did I not interview Guppy, Bedford, Rivkin et al? Because they are household names. We know more or less how and why they trade because we read about it everyday in every issue of Shares magazine. The idea of the book was for unknown individuals to be discussed.

My image is tarnished by working at Macquarie? Perhaps the full story should be known before jumping to broad based conclusions. Yes I ran my own commodities fund and yes it was closed down due to several reasons. Perhaps I should clarify those before the incorrect conclusion is drawn. My partner left and wanted a considerable payout based on 5yrs futures earnings. I was not prepared to risk my family money on that. Secondly the regulatory environment is becoming exceptionally difficult and expensive, especially for a boutique operation. In light of these, money was returned to investors. For your interest I had 90% of my personal assets in the fund and traded actively and with the same risk as all clients. It becomes a "call" option to make money for others as well as yourself.

Moving forward to today. At Reef Capital I had a long association with Macquarie. They had clients who wanted exposure to our type of product and we facilitated the relationship. When they heard I was leaving Sydney for Noosa they put a business proposal to me that made sense. Later this year we will be opening a managed futures fund under the Macquarie banner of which I will be managing, based in Noosa.

Whilst you may not agree about the managing of other people's money, the fact of the matter is that it offers a diversification from other asset classes, and during this period of time, a small allocation to such an asset is a prudent investment. Unlike many "authors" I am more than happy to show you trading results for the variety of programs, futures and options, that we run. These are real client accounts.

As I said, this is not a defense, simply a clarification. I will never do a book on well known names. I cannot see the point. I would do a book more based toward equity traders, but they are few and far between. I am happy for people to email me if they think they would be candidates.

It is not my intention to please everyone, and nobody can do that. We all have different tastes as much as we all use different trading methods. The book has sold well and the publisher has been extremely happy.

Nick Radge